backgroundbob
Senior Writer
A befitting emblem of adversity
Posts: 188
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Post by backgroundbob on Jul 14, 2006 7:26:45 GMT -5
Not really sure how that changes things; in the same way that Sein Fein came to represent the political arm of the IRA, people are obviously hoping the Hezbollah will eventually contribute meaningfully to the proper political process. It doesn't change the fact that Israel is only aggravating problems (not only for the Lebenese people but also in the whole of the Middle East) by launching a full-blown military strike. I see the Beirut's airport has already been destroyed; extremely helpful for people wanting to get out of the conflict zone, no doubt.
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Dream Deep
Speaker of the Forums
ostranenie
Posts: 523
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Post by Dream Deep on Jul 14, 2006 8:56:02 GMT -5
AHHH! Dan! I told you this on YWS and I still mean it now: BE CAREFUL IF YA FIND YOURSELF OVER THERE!!!
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sabradan
Senior Writer
The Godfather.
Posts: 179
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Post by sabradan on Jul 14, 2006 16:51:52 GMT -5
well, right now, I'm in the USA studying so I think I'm safe. Im worried about my best freind Oshri though. Hes a paratrooper commander, and might be sent to fight if it escalates. If gets really bad, I'll put school on hold and do my duty.
Bob, if the world was appalled at both sides, they wouldnt condemn just Israel. Just a thought. And I disagree---Hezbollah, and any terrorist organization--IRA, HAMAS, Islamic Jihad, Al-Qaeda, ETA, etc. will never become legitimate streamlined governmental/political agents.
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Bjorn
Senior Writer
Posts: 104
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Post by Bjorn on Jul 15, 2006 15:34:24 GMT -5
Yes, about Israel 'defending' itself.... Isn't that what Bush said: we're 'defending America'.... Isn't that what they say for WWII 'they died to keep this land free'.... In the latter's case perhaps, seeing as Hitler was indeed the agressor, but the others? We had eye-witness proof of Germany's agression; where are the weapons of mass destruction and chemical weapons Iraq supposedly had heaps of? Somewhere down the line Bush actually admitted that their so-called 'intelligence' was wrong. Seems the U.N. inspectors were right all along. Why did America invade? Because the average fanatical American joe rallied behind Bush. You might as well equate the 'War on Terror' to a 'War on Islam' or a 'War on the Middle-East' a 'War for Oil'-definately not a War on Terror. You don't fight terror with force, because that just creates more Terror! Don't you see, the Bush administration is using a clever game where it incites more terror, so there is a never ending well of terror which America can use as an excuse. The partisans under Tito in Jugoslavia used this tactic during WW2, where they'd kill German soldiers. The Germans had a policy of killing 50 civilians for every German soldier wounded, and a hundred for every killed - the civilian population would no doubt turn to the partisans.
How is Israel defending itself by being the agressor? Perhaps by showing force they are saying 'we mean business', but what will it gain them in the end? Certainly a thousand body-bags and three - the captured Israelis. The death-toll is already rising. Perhaps my logic is wrong, and the Hezbollah did in fact kidnap the soldiers to incite war, and maybe they are working with Hamas. Maybe Iran and Syria are supporting Hezbollah. Then Israel is just acting the way they want it to. But perhaps the U.S. is also behind Israel, we always question the so-called 'enemy' (i.e. the "terrorists"), but why can't we question ourselves, or at least our leaders? To the "enemy" we are the enemy.
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Post by Grif on Jul 15, 2006 15:57:47 GMT -5
George Bush, unlike yourself, doesn't want to wait for a nuclear weapon to detonate before he can take action, especially if action can stop the aforementioned detonation from ever occuring.
This is the entire idea behind a pre-emptive strike: take out your enemy before he has a chance to take you out. Terror is the enemy of all free people, therefore we endeavor to defeat it wherever it is.
Israel is actively hunting down terrorists. It isn't waiting for the terrorists to strike them, they already have. They are now aggressively hunting down terrorists.
Let me just put this out there. America is bullying nations that support terrorist organizations and/or nations that are pursuing a course of action that can threaten the free world. It is doing so in the name of the saftey and security of the American people and the world in general.
This is the state of American Foreign Policy. You can argue about the means all day. In my mind, the means were fair and the ends were fair.
Perhaps this is too harsh. If it is, I apologize. It's what I think of all this, for what it's worth to you.
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sabradan
Senior Writer
The Godfather.
Posts: 179
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Post by sabradan on Jul 15, 2006 17:38:17 GMT -5
Bjorn, you would have a point, if any of your facts about Israel were correct. Israel is in fact, NOT the aggressor here. The aggressor is Hezbollah, and Lebanon, to a lesser extent for tacitly allowing Hezbollah to operate free reign within its borders.
Now, I'm sorry about the innocent loss of life, but as I've said before: Diplomacy doesnt work in Israel's favor. Ever. Force does.
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Bjorn
Senior Writer
Posts: 104
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Post by Bjorn on Jul 17, 2006 0:41:51 GMT -5
Ah, I'm afraid you have me there! Very well, Hezbollah did attack first, and captured the soldiers in the fray. I suppose we shall see were force will takes this conflict. Unfortunately the civilians, yes on both sides, are feeling the wrath of political opponents. They are the metal between the hammer and anvil, and this incitation shall prove to be fatal-already Lebanese protestors have flocked in Ottawa and Montreal, and I see you Dan are prepared to 'defend' (the whole concept of a pre-emptive strike is not new to me, but the flaw lies in the fact that it can, and I believe now, is being sorely abused...) your country. Unfortunately the Judeo-Arab tension runs deep, and unfortunately a group like Hezbollah have a degree of power so near to Israel. I don't mean to be biased, but the civilian Lebanese casualites exceed those of Israels. Not to mention it has been confirmed foreigners (Canadians), children is all I heard quickly, are dead amongst them. Whatever, I have nothing else to say on the subject (to push my views on others is just a form of narrow-minded psychology. I respect yours. . Just be careful you if ever you get 'dragged on in haste to battle' (to quote myself). All we care-free civilians need now is one of our number to be carried off to the Hall of the Slain (which for the warring individual is actually a place to strive for...). (Sorry if this 'apology' seems a little too sugar-coated, but I must take responsibility for my incorrect analysis and asumptions, and patch up any rifts it may cause!)
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sabradan
Senior Writer
The Godfather.
Posts: 179
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Post by sabradan on Jul 17, 2006 18:47:58 GMT -5
No prob, Bjorn. Everyones entitled ot thier own oppinions. I only hope to educate: you must decide for yourself where your oppinion lies. Naturally, I hope its on my side, of course but if its not, at least you've got the facts. And I don't think I'll be serving in this war, for good or bad, unless it gets extrememly escalated REALLY fast (because im in the united states right now, so I haven't been drafted yet. If it gets THAT bad though, I'll put school aside and go. Its my duty as an Israeli.) But I was telling that to my freind Dani, who is in the IDF right now (a jobnik, basically an office job) and he started laughing at me.
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darchoco
Novice
a confused mind put into order
Posts: 8
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Post by darchoco on Jul 18, 2006 14:29:52 GMT -5
I have a feeling that wwIII is gonna be here very soon.... and its gonna be the bloodiest war yet.
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Bjorn
Senior Writer
Posts: 104
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Post by Bjorn on Jul 20, 2006 21:50:22 GMT -5
If WW3 were to start soon, all I have to say is that the world is stupider than Hitler when he invaded Russia without taking a 'blast from the past' so to speak.
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